take all the financial decisions for the city of detroit. what could that manager do? he could look for a bailout, money from michigan or washington, d.c. that would be essentially a bailout of sorts. or, could take the bankruptcy option. that would send a shiver down the spine of the unions because a judge would decide, do the unions get the pensions which they're committed to receive. bill: did you say 14 billion? >> yes. that's the outstanding debt plus their unfunded liability to pay the pensions of retired government workers. bill: i got you. i had a figure here of 327 million. that is the current budget deficit. >> yes. bill: that 14 billion figure is huge. all right, from december of 2012, two months ago, here is joanne watson, city council member in the city of detroit for her solution out of this. >> after the election of jimmy carter mayor coleman alexander young, he went to washington, d.c., he came back home with some bacon. that's what you do. that's what you do. this is, this is our people in an overwhelming way supported the r